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Interview: Bob
Kronbauer
What time did
you wake up at today?
12:30 pm. It was an early day here for me. The alarm went off at noon,
I got up at 12:30. So it takes 4 rounds of beeps to get me up past
noon. Should I talk about how I don't go to bed until 6:30 am? I like
to watch the sun come up.
Yeah, that's
what I was wondering, what kind of hours you run. When you worked in an
office, did you ever sleep under your desk?
Only when the catalog deadline was looming ...before tradeshows. I
lived close enough where I could just go home most of the time, but I
definitely spent sleepless nights at the computer and some under the
desk.
So how come
you're not working in an office anymore? Is there anything you miss
about it?
I miss having a schedule a little bit. I end up staying up all night,
which really isn't good for your mood. I don't miss commutes or feeling
tied down. I'm not much of a self-starter really. I like having a list
of things to work on and due dates for that stuff. I know now why most
artists go mad. There was one point during winter when I hadn't left
the house for 10 days or something. That can't be good. It's mostly a
weather/seasonal thing but I think it's just tough for me to combine
art and business together. I'm still trying to figure out how to make
that happen well. They're diametrically opposed to one another. It's
like trying to put a round peg in a square hole...I just don't think
it's natural to intertwine the two at this point.
To you and
with what you're doing, what's the difference between fine art and
commercial art?
This may be a very microcosmic way of looking at it, but for me, that
difference starts and ends in the in the brain...in conception of
whatever you're creating. I have always tried to approach skateboard
graphics the way that I would approach a painting. It wasn't until
really late in my career that I thought, 'wow. this stuff is being
bought and sold just like everything else in the world.' I really had
blocked that part out of my brain. After I realized that every
skateboard is designed to be sold, (regardless of what company it's
for) it really messed with my head a little. I had opened the
floodgates and allowed that little slice of self-doubt to creep in.
"will it sell?' "will kids like it?" "will shops buy it?" millions of
questions pour in when you open that gate. The harder I'd try, the
worse the results were. I think that taught me a lot about the creative
process.
Element was the first
time in my life that I had someone 'directing' my artwork. The term
'art direction' is a contradiction in a way. And it's nothing against
Element, I'd just never been in that position before. Generally, I'm
hired for what I've done and people want that same approach and style
but skateboarding is a business. And it doesn't matter what company
you're talking about, that company is around to profit, make money,
etc. I came into something that was already established and, as a
result, I had to somehow fit in visually while maintaining my own
style. Skateboard graphics have always been easy for me because I have
fun doing them. When I have to consciously focus on trying hide my
personal style or set out with some kind of plan, it becomes really
hard for me all of the sudden.
In the 'real world',
businesses want to see money and profits on whatever they're making and
selling. I understand that part of it, so when someone is telling you
exactly what they want and you end up jumping through that hoop of
fire, I guess that's commercial art. If you want to stay fed and pay
your bills, you have to do things like jump through the flaming hoop of
fire once in a while. I don't like the term 'fine art' either but I'll
play around with it. I guess 'fine art' is when you draw what you want
and how you want it and hope that someone relates to it or likes it.
To me, that's just
art. Whether it's hanging in a gallery or shoved under the bed. When
you can trick someone (a client or company) into accepting 'fine art'
as 'commercial art' is really the only time that you win. Othewise, if
you just do what people want all day and interpret other peoples'
ideas, you may as well become a plumber or something. The feeling isn't
there. The soul
has been exorcised and what you are left with is this hollow image that
doesn't really stand for anything. It's like a ghost on paper...it's
there, it's floating around but people generally can't relate to it or
feel it.
Cool. You
pretty much nailed what I've been trying to figure out for a few weeks
since I was asked that question myself. Do you ever think about what it
would be like if you had never worked in the skateboard industry?
Yeah, I think about that quite a lot. Especially these days. The one
thing I know for sure is that I would have kept skating regardless. The
graphics that I've done were inspired by being a skateboarder. As much
as I loved art, I think I always loved skating more. It's just that as
I get older, art is a lot easier than skateboarding and I can make
money off of it. I wish I still had the energy and recovery power that
a 16 year old has. But I'm getting up there. I hurt my ribs last year
and they hurt for three months straight. 10 years ago, it wouldn't have
even slowed me down but these days, it keeps me out for a while.
Sometimes I look down at my wrists and I can't imagine what I'd do if I
broke my right arm. Being an artist is like being a carnie. It really
is. You have no insurance, not much stability, you sometimes have to
threaten people to get paid...it's not a life for everyone. It would
probably be an easier life to just go to school and become an art
professor or something like that.
I don't know. I would
have probably kept on working at newspapers doing illustration and
design. I always wanted to write a book so maybe I would have persued
that. Maybe I'd be at Wal-Mart or something. I'm not very driven or
ambitious. I have my moments where I'm a workaholic and I feel like I'm
fairly responsible but I don't have that killer drive that some people
do who juggle all kinds of shit. I like life. I like to kick back and
enjoy it...I like to start my day off slow and I like it to end
reasonably slow. Sometimes I watch those people who slowly kill
themselves for a living, always looking for more power, more money,
more everything and I feel fortunate that I was never in a position
like that where I had to catch myself and back out. I've just tried do
do what I love, let it come naturally, have fun with it and not take it
for granted or push it too hard. I kind of know what it's like to feel
like I'm on my death bed and wonder why I let certain things pass me
by. So after I had that second chance, I feel like I took advantage...I
slowed down, I stressed less, I never push things too hard. If
something is meant to be, it'll happen. If not, think of all the fun
you can have digging yourself out of a hole. There's nothing as
inspiring as having to start over. There's nothing as motivating as
being at rock bottom. I've been there before...it's not so bad.
Do you want to
talk about what happened with your heart?
Yeah... I always had an irregular heartbeat. It was mild enough to
where it was undiagnosed until I was in college but I always knew
something wasn't right with it. I had bad anxiety and panic attacks and
never knew why. I just thought I was maladjusted and nervous. Anyway,
it went crazy for a minute...after it got back to normal I was afraid
to drive, I was on these pills that were killing me, they told me I'd
always have to stay on them. It was crazy. Fortunately, I'm OK but
there was a time when I just wasn't sure. There was one night when I
thought my number was up and that one night was all it took. These
days, I realize how stress and worry can literally kill someone. I
probably read 30 books about psychosomatic illnesses, the placebo
effect, mind/body connections, meditation. I guess that really took me
into the goth period of my life....the memento mori...the realization
that death can happen at any time. Kind of creeped me out.
Do you still
feel like you're in a goth period? If not, what period of your life
would you say you're in right now?
I would say it's post-goth maybe. I did a really long interview with
with a magazine from Spain and the editor kept asking me about goth
stuff because he'd read that old Crownfarmer interview. It was really
funny. I'm not goth at all, really. I was always a fan of The Cure but
that's about as goth as it got. You know though...I liked The Smiths,
Joy Division, Elliott Smith...all of these musicians that were
considered all Gloom and doom. But to me, it was just solid music with
good lyrics. People would consider me a pessimist but I just thought of
myself as a realist. There's a difference. And the only authors I've
really been able to relate to were those crazy, drunken
existentialists..camus, sartre, dostoyevsky. I like facing the idea
that things aren't always perfect and may not be in life. I like really
old horror movies, I like bats, I like things like grim reapers and
shit like that. I don't know. Maybe I am goth. Goth and proud.
Maybe you're
in a goth denial period? What period were you in when you got your
Astroboy tattoo? I read something recently on why you got it and I
decided to stop bugging you about it because I thought it was really
rad what you said. Do you want to repeat that here?
Oh, man. I'm in my Astroboy tattoo denial phase. I was young when I got
it. I drew it up myself and made all these changes to the character. I
can't remember talking about why I got it, but the idea at the time was
that I hoped it would keep me young. Astroboy is strong, but he's still
just a boy. I wanted to remind myself that just because you get old,
you don't have to quit having fun or lose the qualities of youth. Plus,
I drew him in the launch position...he's always going up, it's just
another reminder that you have to keep moving forward in life. I've
thought about getting it covered up several times but I just can't
bring myself to do it. It may have been a mistake, but like all the
other ones, it's mine and I can live with it. Wow. That's not very
goth. I guess I could get some bats tattooed up there flying along
beside of him. Have you seen my other tattoos? I've dripping now. Just
dripping in ink. Does Katie [Bob K's wife] still have the tattoo of the
giraffe I drew or did she get it covered up?
I would tell
you that she got it covered up with an Astroboy tattoo but I said that
I wasn't gonna bug you about Astroboy anymore so I guess I have to
stick with it. So yep, she still has your giraffe on her arm, and we
both still love it. She says that her next one's going to be an old
school textbook-style rainbow trout. Awesome. Did you go fishing much
growing up? I picture WV having a lot of really good fishing holes.
The trout will make good company for the giraffe. I can see Astroboy,
the trout and the giraffe all having a gnarly party. I did used to fish
a lot when I was growing up. My dad was really into fishing so we got
to go all over the place. We'd always stop before we got to the lake
and pick up a Slim Jim and a can of Mountain Dew. Good times. I'd even
bait my own hook as a kid. I don't think I ever kept or ate any of the
fish because I would end up with Blue Gill and other little ones, but
it was fun just to go out and hang out with my dad. I didn't do it much
as I got older, but I'd still be down to hit up a lake here and there.
I'm not much the outdoors type anymore. I guess I became modernized
where I'm always connected to something plugged in. It's a shame,
really. Do you go after the big ones? I always used a bobber...stayed
close to the edge of the lake and mossy areas...you know, always
reeling in a big turd made out of moss and lake crap.
Katie and I go
fishing quite a bit, and we catch a lot of turds. Mostly casting from
shore for trout that are usually about a pound or less. It's a lot
about getting away from the computer and everything and spending time
together, but we're on a serious mission for fish when we're out there.
Big, small, it's just really rewarding to reel one in. What was that
book that you gave to Megan Baltimore called? The one about the kids in
the small town where you grew up? I read it a long time ago and I
remember really liking it but I can't remember the name of it. Have you
been reading much lately?
Do you guys eat the fish or just toss them back? I don't eat fish
really. I have, but it's just not in my food rotation. I hate sushi for
the obvious reasons.
That book is called 'Crum,' by Lee Maynard. It was really hard to find
for a while because it was out of print but they're publishing it again
now. My dad grew up near Crum and it's a good portrayal of early West
Virginia I suppose and a really good read. West Virginia has really
produced some original characters over the years....Jesco White being
the most 'original.' Dancing Outlaw and all that. Good stuff. I haven't
been reading much...not like I used to. When I do, it's usually a
biography or historical account of something or other. Recently, I read
a story about Edgar Allen Poe's death...how it's still a bit of a
mystery. A book about Ian Curtis that his wife wrote about his life and
suicide. Big Nothing, about Elliott Smith. I get fascinated by the
lives of creative people... whether they're dead or alive. I get
inspired by people who continually create music, art, literature,
whatever. I have a lot of favorite musicians and writers, but not many
favorite artists. I'm not sure why. I read once where Elliott Smith
claimed he wished he could create visual art rather than music.
Ridiculous! Anyone can paint. Ever tried playing the guitar? I have and
it's not easy. Writing a song? Ridiculous. Creating a
painting...there's no wrong way! You just start slopping paint around.
And then it sits in a corner somewhere or in a closet. Music gets out
there if it's good, it gets appreciated. Visual art just becomes this
burden to carry around with you that you have to find space for. You
can't compress a painting into an MP3 and pass it around or play it in
your car. What were we talking about?
We were
talking about fishing, but I think we went as far with it as we should.
Did you like that Elliott Smith book? And did you hear that Kurt
Vonnegut died today? How do you feel about that?
I didn't care for the book much. It's one of those situations where
someone who didn't know the person is trying to describe him and a lot
gets lost. I'd say you could learn a lot more about Elliott from
listening to his music than reading a bio. But everyone trying to make
sense of his suicide was looking for an answer and that's the only book
out about him. Maybe we're not supposed to know about peoples' personal
lives as a fan. Maybe it kills the mystique or cheapens the process of
enjoying the art itself. Maybe that's why I like bios about people who
died young. You try to put the pieces together and figure out what went
wrong. It's like playing amateur sleuth. Can you imagine if Morrissey
would have died young? The world would be a completely different place.
OK, I'm half joking about that but look at history...people sometimes
don't relate to someone or their work until after they've died and
that's kind of sad. If it's a musician like Nick Drake, you're left
wondering...what if he would have lived to continue to write and
record? And suddenly it's romanticized and everything that 'could have
been' instantly becomes brilliant and genius and they're exonerated and
forgiven for not ever producing it. When I heard about Kurt Vonnegut, I
instantly thought of the Breakfast of Champions shirt. I'm not kidding.
I was like, 'I wonder if Bob is going to be OK.' Again, another
brilliant guy who died but at least he lived a pretty full life. Did
you ever notice how everyone had some connection to Kurt Vonnegut or
his family? He was like the Kevin Bacon of the literature world.
Everything eventually came back to him.
I'm fine with
it, I think the dude lived way longer than a lot of people expected him
to and he wrote his best stuff decades ago so there's really no "what
kind of brilliance would he have produced if he had lived?" mystery. I
read a bunch of news stories about his passing and they kept bringing
up this quote that he said about Hemingway ending his life with a
period and how he thought a death from old age is more like a semi
colon. I thought that was pretty funny. Let's talk about exclusivity.
How come you didn't show your work in art shows for a long time?
Yeah, it's hard to feel bad about a guy who's died who had a long,
productive life. The art show thing wasn't really intentional. As you
know, I grew up in a small town in West Virginia. There were a lot of
things I couldn't relate to as a result of that. Tagging is one.
'Street art' is another. I just think that I was a product of my
surroundings so I just wasn't into it. When it became the hot thing to
promote at galleries, I just didn't get how skateboarding was lumped
together with tagging and urban street art. I guess I was a
skateboarding purist and maybe I was a little older than most at the
time in skating. Because I was a 'skateboard artist,' I was getting
asked to do a lot of shows in bigger galleries as a kind of nobody and
again, I just didn't get it. A good example was that a gallery in LA
called and said, 'we'd like you to do a two-man show with Ryan
McGinness.' And I was like, 'Who's Ryan McGuinness?' And the curator
was very offended that I'd never heard of him and I guess she thought I
was being a dick. It would be situations like that. I live in Dayton,
Ohio! How am I supposed to know who this artist is and that artist is?
I knew skateboarding, I didn't know art really. And people would invite
me to other group shows and there wouldn't be any other skateboarders
and I just wouldn't do the show because I didn't want my artwork hung
beside of non-skateboard stuff. Maybe it would have been a great
opportunity if I was trying to make money or become a known artist, but
I just didn't want that. That was the bottom line. I was doing
skateboard graphics, I loved doing them and I wasn't looking to make a
name outside of skateboarding in the art world.
If I can do a small
show at a small gallery here and there, I'm stoked to do it. If it
involves a friend or other skateboarders, I'm definitely into it. I
think there will be more skateboarders at these little shows than
artists and I dig on that. I may not be able to sell a piece for $1,000
but I can have fun with it, meet some people and keep it mellow. This
one that I have coming up in Louisville, the gallery is small, you know
because it's in KY that it's not an easy feat to get a gallery open and
keep it going. No offense to Louisville...I know the skate scene is
really rad there but in some states, it's just tough to open a gallery
and keep it going. So I was stoked that there were these people who
were giving it a shot and were nice enough to ask me to come and show
some paintings. I asked if my friend Dave Ackels could show his stuff
too and they were down. So it just worked out really well.
Growing up
skateboarding I think that every kid dreams of becoming pro one day. I
know I did. At what point did you realize that you wouldn't be making a
living off of the act of shredding? Was it like a clear moment that you
can remember or did it just sort of happen?
I remember when I had to make a serious decision about it. I had torn
ligaments in my front ankle and it set me back about a year as far as
progression goes. I didn't have insurance at the time and couldn't
really afford to take care of it, go through rehab and the other stuff
that would have probably kept it from hindering me. So I spent 6 months
trying to relearn tricks and make my front foot flip the board the way
that it used to. My friend, John Drake, was moving to Dayton because he
got picked up by Alien Workshop and was skating with Dyrdek all the
time. John wanted me to move to Dayton too but I was still in school so
I had to make a decision to stay and get my degree. After John left, I
didn't really have anyone to push me the way that he did (he was always
much better than me but it's good to have someone to skate with that's
better than you) and I just quit keeping up with it. At that time, the
small wheels/big pants movement made it's way through skating...I would
go to a spot and kids who had only been skating a year would be filming
pressure flips going 2 miles per hour and It just bummed me out on
skating overall. I kept at it but my heart wasn't in it as far as
trying to kill myself for videos or whatever. I just figured I'd racked
up a bunch of student loan debt and I needed to focus on getting out of
school and trying to make a living.
I don't have any regrets though...I look back on my footage and I could
do some hard tricks and had a lot of fun, but my style was gross. Some
people just naturally have style and some don't. I didn't. John had
really good, natural style so I've always liked to watch guys that make
everything look effortless. I wasn't one of those guys. So a pro career
for me would have been on a crap team and would have been short lived
if it had happened. It's funny though because I used to draw these mock
graphics for John when he was skating for Assault (prior to him getting
on AWS) and eventually I got to do pro graphics for him at AWS so that
was a really rad moment for me. Drake is in Charlotte, NC now doing a
shop called Atmosphere. So if you're in the area, go buy something.
John is one of those guys that I'll always be friends with and I owe
him a lot over the years. If you want to see the ankle footage, I have
it digitized from VHS on my computer somewhere. It's pretty gross.
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